WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:01:42.120 it is friday july 1st 2016 this is room in the trees a podcast about creative vision true living finding your psychographic. The following was recorded on June 9th, 2016. This is episode 11, Quack It Out. Room in the Trees is hosted by Trenton Reynolds and me, Sabrina Harrison. Show notes including pictures, links, video and more for every episode can be found at roominthetrees.com. And bam! Shout it out to Molly Franks Narcissian, our newest Patreon subscriber, and actually my best friend in 6th grade. I want to give a shout out to our iTunes reviewers, Isadora P.N., Pinky Lux School, Firefly Art, and Vapor Punk. Thank you for your reviews, they are so meaningful to us. It totally... made my week. Our guest today in conversation is Tracy Hansen. She's a fantastic being. Over the years, she's been in a few of my workshops and I've truly loved getting to know her. She's wise and fun and I love our deep conversations. I'm really excited to share this one with you. Here we go. We all need to shake it out for a second before we start. I feel like quack it out 00:01:48.200 --> 00:01:52.760 That kind of actually reminds me of what we'd probably do in a workshop together, Tracy, right? 00:01:52.760 --> 00:02:00.020 I think we have done that at a workshop. I'm sure we've cracked it out. We've clapped it out. 00:02:00.480 --> 00:02:01.380 We've quacked it out. 00:02:02.800 --> 00:02:05.760 When did we first meet, Tracy? What was... 00:02:05.300 --> 00:03:06.600 We first met, it must have been like about seven years ago, maybe eight years ago. It was at the very beginning of what I call my artistic journey because I literally had not taken a single art workshop before. Until I came to that first one with you, I had done a little art journaling myself, but I had never taken a class, didn't know what to expect, had never been in like the same space with a lot of other artists. I don't even know how I found it because I literally found it like two days before it was going to start. And then when I saw that there was still like one open space, I couldn't believe it. because I had read Sabrina's books and adored her work, you know, and I was like, what? She's in my town, and there's one space left, and I guess that space is meant for me because I'm going. I couldn't believe I got in. And I've taken, like, two other workshops with you since, Sabrina. 00:03:06.900 --> 00:03:25.520 So what do you remember about it? What stood out because Trent and I are interested in talking with you about the experience of teaching, being a part of a workshop, being a part of a class and just the flow of it and the structure and the non-structure of it. 00:03:25.960 --> 00:04:59.560 Yeah. That first one, you know, of course was my first workshop. Since then I've taken many workshops with lots of teachers in person and online. I've, taught a couple myself. I remember the first thing that you did after we all kind of sat down and introduced ourselves. You did something that I was like, wow, I didn't expect this. You said, let's just talk about a few gentle rules. You created the structure, a soft welcoming structure. It wasn't like too many rules. I mean, we don't as artists like a lot of rules, but I think to create like a really nice structure or container for learning was really impressive to me. I had never really thought about it before. And you did things like talk about letting each other have our own space and our own time to process if we needed it. And other things like not offering unsolicited advice or critique on our work, that sort of thing. And I was like, oh, this is more than just a bunch of girls smearing paint around. There's some structure to it and there's some real learning and benefits that will come out of this and and and truly there was for three days it was the most 00:04:59.560 --> 00:05:11.580 amazing experience Sabrina those rules were they the rules that you had started with or did they come from experience definitely came from experience because 00:05:11.580 --> 00:06:44.860 I really I always feel people have do so much to get there and sign up and organized you know coordinating if they have kids coordinating childcare travel, logistics, in Los Angeles or wherever we're doing it. And that they are giving themselves this time. And that's a really critical thing to acknowledge and remind them that this is theirs. And so whatever I can do to help protect that, that time for them, because I primarily... teach women there's a many many of us have that natural sense of wanting to connect and and you feel sometimes the pressure well you have to chit chat and I was like take away the chit chat we don't have to you know there's time for the depth of what we're because there's so much writing involved would you say Tracy there's so much about it's not just about painting yeah yeah so there's a real surprise too Yeah, there's a lot. You can go deep very quickly. And so, as, you know, I don't know back then, back in the day, how much cell phones we didn't have. I don't know if there were smartphones back then, but that's now something critical. Like, no friggin' Instagramming up the picture of the, like, hand smeared in paint while you're doing it. And it's not because I... It's just, like, just come on. Just... I wouldn't say just get into it, but you know what I mean? 00:06:45.040 --> 00:06:48.720 Allow yourself that space away from our normal routine. 00:06:49.660 --> 00:07:46.500 I think that's what Tracy just said with creating a space. I don't know if that's such a visual description of it, but I think it's an apt analogy is that... there's so much happening in our daily lives and there's so much built up tension and expectation and especially when we're going to a workshop with somebody that we know their work and we have this idea of the experience that we want to have, that for you to take a moment and say, you know, no cell phones and let's not critique each other unless it's asked for specifically, I think it's like giving everybody permission to just... shut out all those voices, shut out all that noise, and just kind of be present without, and not just external noise, but I think like internal noise of like, well, I wanna do this, and I wanna have this kind of experience, but it's just like, get rid of all of that. 00:07:46.500 --> 00:07:48.880 Exactly. The noise in our head is loud enough. 00:07:49.400 --> 00:07:51.780 Yeah. Too loud. 00:07:52.080 --> 00:07:53.580 Yeah. Way too loud. 00:07:54.240 --> 00:08:21.240 And I think that's something that relates to a lot of things that we've talked about in previous episodes of not just creating a space for a workshop, but creating a space for your own personal work. You know, it's hard enough to know when to just stop doing the Facebook and stop trying to keep up with Facebook. your social media presence and just give yourself the afternoon to turn the cell phone off and make work, you know, not have to feel the pressure to keep up with all of that. It's hard to do. 00:08:21.900 --> 00:08:33.600 Right. But if we were like in the corporate world, we couldn't do those things. From nine to five, you'd be working, right? But working as an artist, you have to be a lot more disciplined about that for you. 00:08:33.600 --> 00:08:58.100 yourself. When Sabrina, I think we've talked about like, it's, it can start to feel selfish to, to make that time for yourself. You know, like if you're in a corporate environment, it seems like you're doing the work for somebody else. Yeah. It's legitimized somehow. Legitimize. Exactly. Exactly. So hard to make it feel, uh, as legitimate as working for somebody else when it's like for yourself, but it is, it is. 00:08:58.300 --> 00:09:56.160 I just... Can I say... I'll say one last thing about that before I want to hear your thought. It's just... Just the whole thing about how you're getting... Tying it into the whole getting into your head stuff. It's just so frustrating because you really... well, for us, this is our livelihood. And you have to actually really work. You have to produce stuff. You have to get stuff done. But then on top of that, you're having this voice of not being able to give yourself permission for it. And then that's being doubled by going, I'm not getting enough stuff done. And then if you're uploading and trying to share it to possibly sell it, I've had a harder time in a long time than I've had the past week or so about that. Just really getting in that twirl in your head about, you have to shake it out, I guess. Duck it out. Duck it. Go ahead. Da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da. 00:09:58.420 --> 00:09:58.920 What the heck? 00:09:58.900 --> 00:10:15.740 That's again why conversations are so like, they're just, if you could have, I think Trenton, you talked about your experience at graduate school, that kind of communal shared, but focused. 00:10:16.360 --> 00:11:43.580 So I want to, I do want to. tie that into what we're talking about right now. And that is that Tuesday, I had a demo in the morning and the windows were open. This breeze was coming through. The light was awesome. We had some music going and I was doing my own thing. And I wasn't, you know, if they wanted... feedback or something I was there to give it but it was just it reminded me and this is something that that I've been searching for and I think I think I kind of caught a glimpse of it on Tuesday and that is that I think art art in creating is is a community activity right I think I know there's something healthier to me about being in an environment where you can have conversation that if What you're working on, you can have people look at and respond to. And it's not something that you go into your cave and you create and then you bring out into the light of day and present for the first time. You know, it's like this. The creation, the actual making itself is part of the conversation. And it was awesome. Like I just felt this, you know, this contentedness about being there in that moment. And I think that's the kind of workshop that I would like to, but not just like one experience. It's like a process. It's a community. It's a community. type of environment that I want to create if that makes sense what you're talking about reminds me of 00:11:44.760 --> 00:12:50.340 the literary salons that happened like in the 50s and 60s Also the the the communal groups of artists that were all working at the same times in the same place you know the Picasso's and the Modigliani's and all those guys that were working together and and And they may have not been painting in the same space, but they'd come together afterwards at the cafe and talk about their experience and share their resources and show each other their work and get input and advice. And that's a really amazing experience. thing to have right and it's not a new idea no it's really an older and they were brought together i mean now we feel like we're like connected through social media and stuff when it's really sometimes isolating us absolutely they didn't have social media and even telephones and all that to stay connected so they live in the same cities and they meet up at the same cafes and stuff. That is like would be an amazing thing to have. 00:12:50.700 --> 00:13:04.260 Another manifestation of that same idea is grad school, where you have this whole floor of studios and nobody has a door, they just have curtains in front of the opening and 00:13:04.260 --> 00:13:07.140 you can kind of walk in or knock and come in. 00:13:07.400 --> 00:13:19.100 And it creates this opportunity for chance encounters and chance conversation. And I don't know, it's just kind of bubbling up of ideas and creativity. 00:13:19.600 --> 00:13:23.200 Yeah, the energy just feeds off of itself. Right. Yeah, the group. 00:13:23.200 --> 00:13:52.200 energy. That's fascinating to me to think that it's in so many ways that technology and the way our culture is going is so connective. I mean, it's connecting us in ways that would have never been possible and it's beautiful how well it does that. But it simultaneously is isolating in some very fundamental and profound like human existential level ways that can be very damaging, I think. I 00:14:07.600 --> 00:14:23.660 I just was going to say that's why the whole idea of the True Living Project and that vision of that is what my heart is so forever going to be passionate about, creating that made by, for, and with. And I so deeply believe in that and really wish that could come to life one day. 00:14:23.660 --> 00:14:56.520 You know, for so long you talked about the True Living Project and I kept on trying to poke you and ask you questions like, well, what exactly is the True Living Project? Like wanting it to be more defined at a workshop? Is it a place? Is it a place? kind of artwork or what is it? The more I've heard you talk about it, it's this, it's this dream, right? It's this vision of, of, of conversation, of collaboration, of community tribe, like these, these ideas that are kind of omnipresent in your, it seems like in your mind and definitely in conversation. 00:14:56.980 --> 00:14:57.480 Yeah. 00:14:58.240 --> 00:15:03.980 You know, I, I don't know. It's kind of a beautiful dream. I wonder what that ultimately looks like. 00:15:05.060 --> 00:15:34.440 I've got whole maps of it I've made. I've made – yeah, I've got the whole – I have a whole like three-dimensional landscape map. Show us the maps. Yeah. Oh, yeah. I have – it's going to have a fold-down studio like the walls all fold down so like the whole studio – can then fold down flat in a field, and then you can have performing and playing on the, it becomes sort of a stage, and then there's listening of the whole. There's like 51 projects part of it. 00:15:34.440 --> 00:15:38.720 So it actually is like a brick and mortar place? 00:15:39.060 --> 00:15:54.900 It is, but it is called a true living project because it's made by, for, and with. I think the slideshow that I recently reposted on Facebook of that that I had created years ago, it does kind of have the anthem of what happened the values are of it, what it stands, what it is. 00:15:55.680 --> 00:16:53.440 I think part of what makes it so hard to define is that you're, you're trying to escape definition, you know, and that's, you know, and part of creativity is, And my frustration is as a teacher, you're supposed to come up with ways of systematizing and creating processes and categorizations and all this stuff that is kind of antithetical to the whole idea of creativity to begin with, right? So instead, it's trying to plant these seeds, these ideas, these principles, these foundational concepts, and let them grow. And so I don't know, that resonates with me. Like, you're not trying to create this blueprint of a specific structure and the this is how wide it's going to be and it's going to be made out of this material. It's your you're you have a vision of. but it grows itself. It's not something that you can predefine. 00:16:54.180 --> 00:17:12.400 Because that's what everyone longs for, is their own sense of discovery. I think it's so fundamental in teaching. You know, it's helping create those moments for people really own their experience and their moment, and it affects them in a real way. 00:17:13.000 --> 00:17:24.120 So I want to hear more about Tracy, other profound experiences that you've had in workshops or maybe experiences that have not hit for whatever reason. 00:17:25.460 --> 00:18:23.780 Mostly, I'd say mostly my experience of experiences in workshops and retreats. And by the way, I do think there is a difference between them. Yeah. have been really positive but there have been uh you know a couple of things that weren't my most favorite times which is a gentle way to say it not my most favorite time not my most favorite time um and of course i won't I won't say names or anything like that, but I came away from that learning a lot about maybe it was time that I host my own. So I did, and I've taken, you know, I took everything that I learned from that and other experiences and did host my own, and it was everything I wanted. Yeah. so what is that thing that you always say Sabrina make a make yeah my dad says make a job make a 00:18:23.780 --> 00:18:29.180 job don't take a job and yeah make what you most need to find yeah yeah all that stuff it's really 00:18:29.180 --> 00:18:34.800 hard in your in your workshop what were the things that were absolutely going to be that that you need 00:18:34.800 --> 00:19:09.780 My retreat was four days long. It was in a beautiful, very creative hotel in Palm Springs. I called it the Creative Nomad. And the idea was that everybody was traveling from near and far to really... creative, interesting place outside of their own routine. It involved more than just art journaling together, although that's what we did. I had two different teachers. I was the host. I love that. Yeah, go ahead. 00:19:09.860 --> 00:19:10.360 Sorry. 00:19:10.400 --> 00:20:54.880 Yeah, I didn't want to teach it. I wanted to host it. So I was interested in creating the environment and setting the energy and the tone and creating that container that has become important to me. And so everything was thought out for a very long time on my part. I hope that everybody there enjoyed it as much as I think they did. But everything from curating the music to, you know, picking out some really great food to starting every day with a guided centering meditation to get everybody into the space and very present. to making sure that there was time for us to move around, move our bodies, to allowing there to be some circle time at the end to discuss things, not necessarily a show and tell, but whatever we wanted to share or discuss or didn't. allowing each other time to process and making it a joyful experience, not a silent experience, but making sure that there was time, you know, space for everybody to breathe a little bit and to step out of their ordinary routine and to really get into their work and to have some fun. And then allowing them all some time at night to get it together on their own, their own plans, some space away. You know, I could hear people making reservations or taking... you know, for dinner or taking walks afterwards or swimming in the pool, you know. I tried to take a little bit of everything I had learned and made it into something that I enjoyed. And I think that translated into their enjoyment as well. 00:20:54.900 --> 00:22:00.680 well hmm can we go oh gosh that sounds great I appreciate that you eat all of that it was amazing for me yeah and I like I like the different a different has that the word differentiation differ different how do you say different differentiation delineation. Is that right? Delineation? Delineation? Between host and teacher because I really have appreciated when I have had experiences where I had someone who hosted the workshop and then I could do my thing, but I really trusted their, when you can collaborate with someone else who loves the logistics and has a great sense of tone and environment you know so I'm not kind of rushing to try to create that especially when I'm teaching in different places you're trying to kind of make this peaceful atmosphere but you're like I'm working with this random conference room I can't there's overhead lighting it's fluorescent 00:22:00.680 --> 00:22:20.180 lighting how do you that's that's one of the other challenges I think that's not unique to our time but definitely exaggerated in our time and that is like we can't just be the artist, we can't just be the teacher, we have to be the artist, the teacher, the facilitator, the person who plans the food. 00:22:20.900 --> 00:22:21.880 To the marketer. 00:22:22.080 --> 00:23:15.520 To the marketer, exactly. We have to do everything. I think of, and in some ways it's good because it forces you to learn and get out of your comfort zone, but it definitely spreads you so thin that it often feels impossible to make. sure everything all your stuff is in a you know in a row and planned yeah i mean just being in this space and this is something sabrina and i have talked a lot about is just we're not we haven't invested a lot of time and energy into understanding business and how to how to interact and communicate about business and doing that too much about our own work starts to feel like it's detracting or polluting the experience of, you know, so it's hard to figure out how to... be a jack of all trades. 00:23:15.960 --> 00:23:34.360 Well, I'm just personally a really big believer in working to your strengths and letting other people work towards their strengths. And that's a really great way to collaborate. When you know that your strength is teaching, 00:23:35.240 --> 00:23:36.980 then teach. 00:23:37.360 --> 00:24:16.980 Let other people do the other stuff. and a lot of times that can seem daunting because it's like well then I have to pay somebody or I have to spend time I have to train them or whatever it it always seems to work out in my experience that it freeing yourself up to do what it is that you're best at allows more energy and money and all that stuff to flow It allows the right customers to find you when you're not all personally involved up in that stuff. And you let somebody else who's really good at that do that for you or with you. 00:24:17.000 --> 00:24:17.500 Right. 00:24:17.580 --> 00:24:33.060 You know, because you do have to give direction. You do have to train. You do have to make sure that your people that you work with that are helping you with your delivery of your product understand what it is that you want, your message that you want to put out there. 00:24:33.380 --> 00:24:33.880 Hmm. 00:24:33.800 --> 00:25:11.780 So what if we took the True Living project as kind of like a case study? Sabrina has this vision of creating an actual location where there's some kind of gathering or community that comes together to create a literal space and also a figurative, you creative space. Sabrina, what about that process do you feel like daunted by or is impossible or that you can't do? Does that make sense? Yeah, I think that's an interesting question. I think it 00:25:11.780 --> 00:25:50.160 is because it's a huge vision. It's getting major players on board that are investors in the vision. And I don't feel – I feel very confident in the vision I have and the possibilities with it, but I'm not that middle person that goes – that negotiates that kind of is the – the connection between those two, the vision and then the people that are, because I think companies, there are companies out there that would love to have something like that be something that they stand behind, believe in that they're, 00:25:51.360 --> 00:25:53.180 that they could be. 00:25:53.440 --> 00:26:08.420 Yeah. That person that's, That those people that are kind of like, I guess you would call them like a venture capitalist or a fundraiser or whatever. That's not your desire. That's not what you want to do. No. You want to be the chief fort builder. 00:26:10.300 --> 00:26:14.060 Yes, I do. Ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding. 00:26:15.000 --> 00:26:15.500 Right. 00:26:16.420 --> 00:26:22.480 And you should be. We all know you're the great fort builder. doesn't mean that you're going to be the great fundraiser. 00:26:22.820 --> 00:26:30.140 Yeah, that's the quote of the year. Yeah, there's great fundraisers out there. Yeah, who are passionate about it. 00:26:30.660 --> 00:26:36.400 Yeah, but the fort builder has to share her vision so that that fundraiser gets it. 00:26:36.600 --> 00:27:03.800 Right? Yeah. Well, I think sometimes to me, it's, it's daunting to think of, well, a, just to, just to believe in yourself. That's a good idea that there are people out there that, that want that, you know, there's a demand for it. There's people that would gladly get behind it. Just to believe in yourself is like a hard enough step. Number one, but then to actually go out and I don't know, something about asking for money is... 00:27:03.800 --> 00:27:06.260 It's always been an artist's struggle. 00:27:06.680 --> 00:27:08.420 It's terrible. It's terrible. 00:27:09.640 --> 00:27:10.140 Oh, yeah. 00:27:11.080 --> 00:27:20.840 So is there... Can we talk about like a step-by-step of how that even happens? Like how does Sabrina... She's got an idea. Mm-hmm. 00:27:20.900 --> 00:27:24.460 Let's start with you, Trent. Can we use you as a case study? Please. 00:27:25.460 --> 00:27:28.600 I am much more comfortable using you as a case study. 00:27:28.600 --> 00:27:34.520 I'm much more comfortable today. It's been a rugged week today. It's honestly... 00:27:34.520 --> 00:27:48.400 Let's talk about your studio. Yeah, we're vision people. Big thinkers and vision people. You gotta start small. And I know that's not the big dream... 00:27:48.400 --> 00:27:49.280 Right. Right? 00:27:49.780 --> 00:28:25.200 But instead of the true living project, it might have to be the mini living project. Just the living, the actual living project. And then we all kind of know that once you start the momentum, it's amazing. You start going in the direction that you want. It's amazing the people that show up, that come across your path, that align themselves and go, oh, I want to be a part of that. Oh, that... It happens all the time when you're flowing in the direction of your dreams That the mighty forces come to your aid 00:28:27.780 --> 00:28:41.460 And then all the critical voices go in yeah, I believe that the critical voices think but then I'm what if people come in to that support But this is a perfect example like today. You guys are exactly who I need to talk to 00:28:42.100 --> 00:28:42.600 and 00:28:42.600 --> 00:29:14.760 you know, in that way. Yeah. Yeah. But and me too. Yeah. I'm a little bit probably more like, I mean, I am a creative person. I am but I'm like, I come from a A scientific background a long time ago and then a corporate background. So I'm kind of, you know, what is that? The left brain a little bit lean towards the left brain. So being around true creatives such as yourselves is really helpful for me. 00:29:17.060 --> 00:29:23.160 We all have our own strengths and it's a beautiful thing when they come together. 00:29:23.920 --> 00:29:27.120 Yeah. Too true. 00:29:28.700 --> 00:29:31.240 Can we talk about you as a case study, Trenton? 00:29:32.460 --> 00:29:33.420 Just your studio? 00:29:34.140 --> 00:29:36.600 Let's look around. Let's talk about studios for a minute. 00:29:37.480 --> 00:29:38.800 Yeah. What's that? 00:29:39.380 --> 00:29:45.020 Let's talk about studios for a minute. You guys are there, and here is Trenton. You just rented it. 00:29:45.440 --> 00:29:47.800 And the light is so amazing in here. Is it? 00:29:48.100 --> 00:29:49.000 Wow. Yeah. 00:29:49.000 --> 00:30:09.100 So let me give some background I guess. About three years ago, two years ago, something like that, I started, I was teaching at Santa Monica College but I'm adjunct so they can only give me ten hours or if they give me more than that then they have to start paying me benefits so they don't want 00:30:37.900 --> 00:32:43.820 And it was nice, but I had this feeling that I wasn't there. And that's what I was talking about with Tuesday. I finally got a glimpse of what it actually needs, what I want it to be. So I know I have a vision. I don't know what it looks like, but I know it's there, and I'll know it when I see it. Yep. And so I was talking to my, I've been developing a bunch of online projects, an online course, a website that's all kind of built around cataloging materials and techniques and projects and ways to kind of connect people with the information and ways to put it all together. But I was talking to my brother one time, and he's a musician, and he was saying how he'd been online for years publishing his music, but it wasn't until he started playing live gigs that his online stuff started to take off. It was that relationship between real in-person experiential music and developing that audience that his online audience just started to pick up. There's something about the legitimizing effect of having an actual physical presence. So that in combination with obviously my already existent desire to have a studio space where people could come. And I always knew that I wanted to have a combination of online and in person. I think there's a lot of potential there. yeah um so that's why i ended up getting this space but then i got the space i moved in i sent out an email to all my people and i was pretty sure that you know i'd at least be able to get the same people that i had and come to the garage pretty much same description of the workshop same price um and not a word no response at all So I wrote another email. I said, well, next week, you know, I didn't hear from anybody, and I just want this to be a space where you want to come, 00:32:43.940 --> 00:32:47.360 and, like, I'm just trying to, I want this to be a creative space. 00:32:47.900 --> 00:32:48.400 A community. 00:32:49.500 --> 00:33:18.460 So come by next week. I'm going to be here all week, and you can just come see the space and tell me what you think. So I did that for a week and got a lot of really good feedback. I talked to Sabrina a lot, and, And from that, I decided to just do, instead of doing five-week-long workshops, three hours a week, I decided just to do two demos, one demo on Tuesday morning, one demo on Thursday morning, and you could just come and watch the demo. And if you wanted to, you pay for a number of hours of access to the studio space. 00:33:18.700 --> 00:33:19.200 Awesome. 00:33:19.760 --> 00:33:31.180 Good ideas, I thought. So the demos are picking up. But people still don't- Can I just throw in one thing? Of like paying for access. Yeah, go ahead. 00:33:32.360 --> 00:33:52.420 There's also like an element of you got the space and you like sent out the email. It wasn't like you had a six-month, you know, lead up, baiting like- It's happening six months, you know, it's like countdown, you know, 30 more days studio It it was a pretty light no and that was part of the problem 00:33:52.420 --> 00:34:12.560 That was a real thing like it was like I think I should get a studio space and then the next day I go looking three days later I find a space to a week later I'm in the space and I two days later I'm sending out an email saying, oh, I got this new space coming. Workshops are going to start next week. Right. So there was no, so it took people off guard. 00:34:12.620 --> 00:34:22.200 No build up of suspense and excitement. And that's all marketing stuff. Right. That's all the stuff that the big advertisers use. 00:34:22.360 --> 00:34:30.740 And I hadn't been teaching the workshops for like six months. I stopped teaching them in my garage because I was focusing on online marketing. 00:34:30.700 --> 00:34:36.740 So maybe they moved on a little bit, found other ways to fill their time. 00:34:36.740 --> 00:34:46.320 And they weren't the students that you were exactly, you were kind of interested in moving on from the same type of format too. 00:34:46.320 --> 00:34:51.660 That's the other thing is, the next thing that happened is that when it didn't happen 00:34:51.660 --> 00:34:53.200 the way I kind of anticipated. 00:34:53.200 --> 00:35:36.320 kind of expected it to happen. Sabrina gave me, you know, just talking to Sabrina, I was, she challenged like, well, is that even what you want? You know, this is what you were doing in the garage. You know, maybe that's not the format you wanted, you want to do. And you just did it that way before, because that's the way it had to be before. But now that there's a new place and a new context, maybe it can be something totally different. So that's kind of where I'm at and have been for the past two weeks. weeks is just like I come in here and I've got plenty of other stuff to work on but I'm just like soaking and try to really understand what it is that I even want right and I I guess in part that's 00:35:36.700 --> 00:36:07.960 Yeah. Well, I think that that's the what do you call the incubation part of birthing something new is that you have to discover, take time and listen to yourself, you know, whether it's writing or or daydreaming or whatever about what it is that you want to create. and who it is that you want to serve, who that person, you know, who your dream client or customer is. 00:36:10.680 --> 00:36:30.760 That's a big part of it. Until you are clear on that, it's really hard to reach them. because you're not clear in your own desires, how can you create a really solid message to attract or to align with those people that are interested in the same things unless you know what it is yourself? 00:36:32.800 --> 00:37:13.020 - There's some negative self-talk that buys into that and I can't talk too much about it, I'm gonna start crying right here, but I really want and long to converse with my peers thus far my primary audience has been older retired adults because one of the programs I teach for is for older retired adults and they have more time and I really do connect with that community really well and I enjoy that but I do have a longing to engage and create a community of my peers but I have this negative self-talk about I'm just not I'm not that guy. 00:37:13.020 --> 00:38:41.640 I just want to stop you right now because this is what I just, and stop me if I'm wrong, but this is just what I want to say. Artists need to stop thinking that marketing is bad. You don't have to be some corporate mogul marketer, big advertiser to be successful. What you need to do is believe in yourself, your work, and know what it is, know what your work is, know what your value is, because creativity is the most valuable thing. In the world, there is no corporation that could survive without immense amounts of creativity. Being an artist is a calling. It is good. It was what you were created for. These are your inherent talents and gifts. There is nothing wrong with sharing them. Sharing them is... will lead to sales. You don't have to be some dirtbag, scumbag marketer to sell yourself. You can just share of your talents, your gifts, make the invitation to align with the people that you want to align with, and they will come. Hmm. 00:38:42.100 --> 00:38:45.360 I guess that's what I fear is that they won't come. 00:38:45.620 --> 00:39:53.220 They will come. They will come. I know. Tracy came. Tracy came. Right. And believe me, I didn't have a lot of money. I didn't have a lot of free time. I had never picked up a paintbrush before. But Sabrina, her work spoke for itself. Her invitation that I saw was... reeked of her, you know? It made me want to be in that company and in that experience. I found what I was looking for, and one thing has led to another, and another. I've continued to follow my curiosity. Mm-hmm. You have to make them curious. It's about magnetizing, attracting. It's not about selling. It's aligning with and offering your gifts, your talents, your vision, and they will find you. Will it happen overnight? Probably not, but maybe, you know. 00:39:54.200 --> 00:40:05.060 but that's just my that's my soapbox and i so well said tracy and what i was meaning is tracy came meaning that you came today like you were interested you came to trend studio you were 00:40:05.060 --> 00:40:47.780 interested you've been listening to the podcast yeah i invited myself over here right i mean yes i was so thrilled to be invited to be a podcast i could have done it from my my my phone at home right but i'm like no i invite myself over here here because I want to be aligned. I want to be in that company. I want to be a part of that. I want to grow and learn. I want to spend my hours doing the things I love. This is what I love, to be in conversation with other creatives. There are other people like me that want to be in conversation with creatives and want to share space and share energy and environment with other creatives. Hmm. They just haven't found you yet. 00:40:49.860 --> 00:40:54.760 And I haven't found them. Yeah. And I guess... You need to know who they are. 00:40:55.000 --> 00:41:00.920 Yeah. Yeah, I guess maybe... I'm not talking names. I'm talking about, you know, in advertising, they call it a demographic or a psychographic. 00:41:01.240 --> 00:41:17.040 It's about what those people are interested in. This conversation is so interesting to me about that because Trenton and I are in different situations, but similar shifts in adjusting to demographic is that fills us up and where we can be best used. 00:41:17.780 --> 00:42:00.980 I think the idea of a psychographic, that's a new word to me, but I think you and I, Sabrina, are like, I think that in a lot of ways we're complete opposite. And part of that is what I find about our conversation so compelling is that I learn a ton. But I think we probably have the same psychographic. Yeah, that's interesting. There's something... We belong to the same psychographic and we're trying to appeal and find a similar psychographic. I don't even know if I'm using that word correctly, but something, it's not an age, it's not a gender, it's not a... 00:42:02.020 --> 00:43:09.660 What theory? interested in. Exactly. It's their psychology. It's their emotional state. It's what they would... Identity. Yeah. It's their real true personal core identity. The things they want to do, the way they want to spend their time. Yes. How they... It's like... The things that they're willing to part with their money for and I'm not saying I don't mean that in a horrible Salesman way. I mean I would pay to be here today because I love this right You need to find those people who would You know They want to spend their money on this sort of thing in being in a studio environment Rather than a hundred thousand other things they could be spending their money on. Right? I spend a lot of money on books and art because I love that. But for another person, it might be, you know, on thousands and thousands of dollars worth of clothing. And I wasn't advertising for 15 years, so that's... I kind of I love you a few terms 00:43:09.660 --> 00:43:14.660 I love you so much Tracy we need this so hard I know I know 00:43:14.660 --> 00:43:18.880 this is all new territory for me use me 00:43:18.880 --> 00:43:26.020 okay you guys are awesome give Trent a give Trent a big hug hug it out for we'll do okay 00:43:26.020 --> 00:43:28.140 quack it out yep 00:43:28.140 --> 00:43:30.880 quack it out quack quack quack quack quack 00:43:30.880 --> 00:43:31.700 okay 00:43:31.700 --> 00:43:33.740 over and out bye 00:43:33.740 --> 00:45:21.900 Tracy Hansen Such a great and much needed conversation. And it was awesome, even if I was a bit self-conscious, to have her here in the studio with me when we recorded. She's such a generous and open person. It really was a great privilege to meet you, Teresa. And I'm sure she'll be back. Thank you. In the meantime, you can find her artwork at dreamdiggerstudio.com. Friend and intern Paul Clark edited this show. You can see what Paul is up to at pdclark.com. You can find show notes for this episode at roominthetrees.com. You can support us at patreon.com backslash room. And if you have a moment, it really helps us to reach more people if you rate us on iTunes. Several of you did rate us and leave fantastic reviews this week. Thank you for taking the time to do that. My brother Brent provided the music for this podcast. You can hear more of his music at soundcloud.com by searching for Ventor's Stag Motel. And I hope you join us again next week for another great conversation. And now, it is just about July 4th. For those of you in the U.S., happy Independence Day. For everyone else, I hope you too will spend some time this week relaxing and enjoying favorite foods and good company. I'll tell you what I'm after. A nap, alone in a quiet dark room, a burger, and some good music. That, my friends, is independence. ♪ ♪ 00:45:21.900 --> 00:45:28.080 Don't fart. Uh-oh, he's starting the cyclone.